ONTD

11:07 am - 06/11/2014

Lily Tomlin Calls Out Beyonce

Lily Tomlin talks about Beyonce selling sex, why Ms. Frizzle was ambiguous with her sexuality and more.





Lily Tomlin Talks Favorite D*ck Pic, The Beygency & Ms. Frizzle
The Interview Even She Can't Wait To Read
By Chris Azzopardi

Originally printed 6/10/2014 (Issue 2223 - Between The Lines News)



It's nearing the end of my 40-minute chat with Lily Tomlin when she steps off her feminist soapbox and wonders what just happened.

"I can't wait to see what you make of this conversation," says the Cass Tech grad, who performs June 14 at Hill Auditorium as part of the Ann Arbor Summer Festival. Along with the sexual ambiguity of Ms. Frizzle and the hope she has for her hometown, the 74-year-old comedian is referring to the broad scope of our interview: the Rolling Stones diatribe that provoked someone to attack her with a hairbrush, her favorite "dick painting" as a kid and, naturally, "The Beygency."

So, Lily, you're kicking off the Ann Arbor Summer Fest on June 14.

Oh, am I kicking it off?

You and Edith Ann.

Edith Ann - that little bitch.

As a Detroit native, have you been keeping tabs on what's going on here?

I have, yeah, quite a bit.

What's your hope for Detroit?

My hope for it is that it's gonna rise. It can't get much more beat down, and I think with all the young people and artists moving there, I pray to God something happens, that life comes back to it. I mean, Detroit was - how old are you?

I'm 31. I didn't experience it like a lot of people did, but my generation is helping to revive it.

Oh, that's so fabulous! I'll tell you, it was such a great city. It was really a good-looking city too. It was fun, it was gritty, it was political. I grew up near Clairmount and 12th Street - those are my old haunts. The old apartment house I grew up in was burned in the '67 riots - that was where I spent my whole early life.

When you return to Michigan, do you drive around your old stomping grounds?

Yeah, I actually do. I usually try to go to the art museum. There's a painting there - Bruegel's The Wedding Dance - that hangs low on the wall. It's really a beautiful painting, and all the townspeople are dancing and the men have codpieces so they look like they have erections. When you're a grade school kid going there on a field trip, it hangs right at eye level for a 7- or 8-year-old. I found it the most fantastic dick painting I had ever seen. (Laughs) I shouldn't have done it, but I did steal a snapshot of me in front of the Wedding Dance - with the flash!

A selfie before selfies were a thing?

Well, I had someone else take it. We were covert. Anyways, Detroit was fabulous. Maybe everybody feels that way about their hometown, but I do think Detroit was special. To see what's happened, it kind of ruins your heart. It just ... it holds so many memories for me, so much sensory stuff, that it's hard for me to get that it's not the way that it was, even though I know empirically it isn't - I've been there many times. If I come to Detroit, you can turn me on to some places to go by.

Is your wife, Jane Wagner, coming with you?

Most likely she won't. She's not from Detroit at all - she's from Tennessee - but she doesn't like to travel that much.

Even though you two just got married last year, you've been together for 150 years.

(Laughs)

How much did taking that step change your relationship? Did it change it at all?

We've been together 43 years and it changes in the sense that, "Yeah, we're married, that's right." But what changed most is, we got letters from relatives. Pretty much everybody (in our family) is Christian Fundamentalist, and I grew up in the Baptist church, so I'm acquainted with all that stuff, and we got a lot of letters from our relatives congratulating us. That was pretty surprising.

You never made a big to-do about your sexuality, but have you noticed how much pressure the media puts on celebrities to come out? What are your thoughts on the media's obsession with outing people?

I just talked to somebody not even two or three days ago and they were saying, "Don't you think celebrities should come out? All of them!" I said, "No, because I don't know what their circumstances are." They can't be responsible to everybody. As far as making a big declaration about your own sexuality, I'm not gonna be the one to judge what other people do unless they're doing something really horrible and destructive and ugly. They can still support the gay issues and gay causes and women's issues and so on, and they can support positive constructive things in the society, but I'm not gonna stand in judgment of another individual.

In the upcoming Netflix series "Grace and Frankie" you're back together with Jane Fonda, your "9 to 5" co-star. What's it like working with Jane again?

Jane and I are good friends. I email, talk to her, see her, but we don't work together formally until August. Right now the writers are all writing. They've chosen a director. They've chosen Tate (Taylor), who directed "The Help." We don't know who the husbands are gonna be yet - we're still waiting. But everybody's throwing names in the hopper.

Dolly Parton recently expressed interest in reuniting with her "9 to 5" co-stars on the series, as well.

I think that would be fabulous, glorious - the three of us! You know, we tried forever to get another "9 to 5" script together before we all got older, so yeah, I would love her to be on the show.

Whatever happened to the sequel?

I guess one of us might have agreed and someone didn't, or they wanted this change or they wanted that change. We shouldn't have been so fussy. It could've been managers. Who in the hell knows. You know, (writer) Colin Higgins died - that put a wrench in the work.

Were you surprised "Malibu Country" didn't get a second season pickup?


Yeah, I thought it would just because of Reba, if nothing else. The thing is, it was replaced by "Neighbors."

And "Neighbors" was recently canceled.

"Neighbors" didn't even do as well as we did in the time slot, but I heard it was (ABC executive) Paul Lee's favorite show. He chose "Neighbors" over us.

Ah, that's disappointing.

(Laughs) You said it. I loved Reba as a person. I had so much fun being her mother, because she's like a 10-year-old when she gets to talking to you. Oh, Jesus - she kills me.

Did you at least get to keep your custom-made grandma wig?

Well, I paid for it, I reckon so.

Then, yeah, you better be keeping it.

I always pay for my own wigs because I don't wanna give them up.

As a feminist trailblazer, what do you think of modern examples of feminism, like Beyonce and "Girls," for instance?

Well, how do you represent that? What does that mean to you?

Yeah, well, I guess that's what I'm asking you.

(Laughs) You mean Beyonce's total use of her body? Is that what you mean?

Yeah, a lot of people think of Beyonce as a feminist, as somebody who embraces herself as a powerful woman - she's even called herself a "modern-day feminist" - and I was curious to know your thoughts on that.

Yeah, well, I think that's great, and what can I say? She is a pretty popular woman and she's married to a very powerful man, but she's still selling sex. She's selling a lot of sex to teeny-boppers. I don't know. Who are her fans? Everybody?

Everybody loves Beyonce, Lily, and if you don't there's "The Beygency," which is, according to "Saturday Night Live," a secret government agency who takes down anyone who doesn't.

Oh, shit. I like her! I don't dislike her! But I don't pay any attention to that because - I mean, she's fantastically beautiful and dances, but, you know, it's very suggestive. If I was a 10-year-old, I would try to emulate her like most 10-year-olds do.

For me, young girls are too sexually available! I got in trouble with the show "Girls" because I was doing a junket and 80 people come through from different publications or networks or whatever to interview you. So, this girl comes in and she goes, "What do you think of 'Girls'? I said, "I haven't really watched it that much." That was the truth!

So, I shouldn't even talk about Beyonce because, hard as it is to believe and as much as she is present in the culture, I'm not terribly conversant with Beyonce. If you played her songs, I wouldn't necessarily recognize them. I'm familiar with her image and how incredibly vivacious and sexual she is to watch, so I just chalk it up to the culture. I don't pay any attention to it anymore.

The culture is so sexualized with girls and women. I was in a recording studio and a little girl who was about 4 years old was watching TV, and somebody's dancing on the TV in very elaborate sexually overt dance steps and the little girl goes, "Oh, she's hot." I'm thinking, this is a 4-year-old!

She should be thinking about playing with her Barbies - wait, no, even Barbies are sexualized, so never mind.

(Laughs) She should be thinking about penetrating the Barbie or something, or bringing Barbie and Ken - I don't know what she should be thinking about! But stop it right now! You're gonna put words in my mouth! The whole Beyonce thing is gonna come after me. They'll send Solange after me. I'll be in the elevator and they'll beat the hell out of me.

Jay-Z and Beyonce are their own thing. I mean, they come swathed in a culture that is wide and deep, and that's great. They make a lot of money. I don't know what else they do. I don't know about them.

Listen, I was one of those people all through the '60s. Because rock 'n' roll was a male-dominated culture, as a feminist, I railed against it. I railed against the fact that girls were used sexually, that they would just follow guys all over the planet. I cannot defend my state of my mind, that's what I was thinking at the time. Look, when the Rolling Stones had that album "Black and Blue And Lovin' It" - whatever it was called (editor's note: it was called "Black and Blue") - it showed a woman bound, sitting on a chair with her hands behind her back. She's black and blue, she has bruises all over her. I mean, this was part of marketing!

I got into a big fuss with someone. I had a hairdresser on a movie and she started railing against these teenage girls, the way they went around and behaved. I said, "They're an effect of the culture. Why do you support a culture?" She threw a hairbrush at me. She got so mad. She was mad at the girls, she was blaming me, the victim, the subject. I said, "How do you like the idea of a little 12-year-old girl down there at Tower Records going through those bins and seeing this cover with this girl bound and black and blue? The Stones, a very powerful group, is extolling this as the ideal feminist image, like, "Yeah, yeah, this is how she should be: black and blue and loving it."

What's the ideal feminist image to you?

There is none. I'm totally existential. I have no investment in the society or anything. Anything that could happen - I'm way too beyond that mark to think that I'm gonna change it.

Well, you should know that one of my sheros is Ms. Frizzle of "The Magic School Bus," who you voiced in the '90s. There's an ideal feminist - am I right?

(Laughs) Now you're talkin'! But we don't know - does Ms. Frizzle have a BF or a GF? We don't know.

But you know she could take down Solange in an elevator.

(Laughs) Say I said that. Get a whole thing going where Beyonce's people are gonna come after me because I said, "Ms. Frizzle could take down Solange in an elevator."

On it. But seriously: I grew up with Ms. Frizzle and my life motto's always been, "Take chances, make mistakes, get messy."

Aw, see, that is so worth life.

What an icon she is, though.

Ann Richards, ex-governor in Texas - she's now dead - had a leadership school called Ann Richards School for Young Women Leaders. They asked me to speak to the students who are all young girls. They had no idea who I was. Finally I thought, "What's wrong with you, Lily?" I said, "I do the voice of Ms. Frizzle on 'The Magic School Bus'!" They all cheered! They were so absolutely excited. I was home-free. Then, the most wonderful thing: This young girl stands up, she had to be 10 or 11 years old, and she goes: "Ms. Tomlin, what do you think you've contributed to the world with your work?" I stopped dead. I said, "I hope I've caused people to feel more connected." They thought that was admirable. To them, that was good enough.

People don't make the connection that you voiced Ms. Frizzle, do they? When you're a kid, you think Ms. Frizzle voices Ms. Frizzle.

We were at Jane's sister house a few years ago when her niece and nephew were little, and they're sitting on the couch with me and Ms. Frizzle was on. They didn't believe I'm Ms. Frizzle, so Ms. Frizzle would say something and then they'd turn real fast to me and say, "You say it!" I had to audition for Ms. Frizzle. (Laughs)

I had a wonderful time chatting with you, Lily. Always do.

Yes, yes. You were a lot of fun. I'm gonna write you right now. I've wanted to do something for Detroit, and I've been in touch with all these people but I have never done anything substantial. I'm not holding back here, Chris. Gonna dive in with both feet. You'll probably be leading the charge of the Beyonce takedown.

I promise you I'm not affiliated with The Beygency.

Right. I'll think everything's cool and you'll lure me to a meeting place and they'll all be there waiting for me.

If I get you in an elevator, you might wanna run.

"An Evening with Lily Tomlin" is at 8 p.m. June 14 at Hill Auditorium, 825 N. University Ave. For more information, visit http://a2sf.org.
Chris Azzopardi is the editor of Q Syndicate, the international LGBT wire service. Reach him via his website at http://www.chris-azzopardi.com.



Source: www.pridesource.com
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onyxobsidian 11th-Jun-2014 03:16 pm (UTC)
A selfie before selfies were a thing?

Why do people insist that taking photographs of yourself didn't happen before the word 'selfie' become a buzz word?
atomicdogmeat 11th-Jun-2014 03:19 pm (UTC)
Isn't the word just a shorting of self portrait? A thing people have been doing forver.
onyxobsidian 11th-Jun-2014 03:20 pm (UTC)
Essentially, yeah. But there's this huge trend of finding pictures older than, say, 5 years old of people taking self portraits and somehow acting like they were innovators of the selfie era.
tadashee 11th-Jun-2014 03:33 pm (UTC)
I used to call them myspace pictures, because I remember people taking pictures of themselves in front of mirrors and posting them on myspace.

But the act has always been around, just more obnoxious because of self facing cameras
20727 11th-Jun-2014 03:34 pm (UTC)
well she meant that a friend took it. she said that lol.

ia though.
saintvlas22 11th-Jun-2014 03:39 pm (UTC)
Shit, Ancient Egyptians were chiseling their own selfie duck faces onto stone walls thousands of years ago.
funhouse 11th-Jun-2014 04:41 pm (UTC)
What's annoying is when people call normal photos of people selfies. No, they're just pictures with people in them...
lr489 11th-Jun-2014 03:17 pm (UTC)
She's so fascinating. I wish this was on video.
weatherstaff Thank you for this. 11th-Jun-2014 03:18 pm (UTC)
"No, because I don't know what their circumstances are." They can't be responsible to everybody. As far as making a big declaration about your own sexuality, I'm not gonna be the one to judge what other people do unless they're doing something really horrible and destructive and ugly. They can still support the gay issues and gay causes and women's issues and so on, and they can support positive constructive things in the society,

marmar627 Re: Thank you for this. 11th-Jun-2014 03:22 pm (UTC)
Same, I loved this.
bostongirl2003 Re: Thank you for this. 11th-Jun-2014 04:13 pm (UTC)
yet of course the article title is all bait-y
funhouse Re: Thank you for this. 11th-Jun-2014 04:42 pm (UTC)
mm maybe i should've read before i judged :/
mspopstar 11th-Jun-2014 03:19 pm (UTC)
Hew is this stale-ass 'feminist'?

Everybody loves Beyonce, Lily, and if you don't there's "The Beygency," which is, according to "Saturday Night Live," a secret government agency who takes down anyone who doesn't.

Oh, shit. I like her! I don't dislike her!


This hypocritical heffa
fionaapple 11th-Jun-2014 03:21 pm (UTC)
she never said she didn't like Beyonce. She just said she feels that Beyonce presents an image of hypersexuality to young children who are susceptible to that kind of thing. Even later in the article she basically chalks that up to media culture and not Beyonce herself
mspopstar 11th-Jun-2014 03:29 pm (UTC)
I read it, and it's kind of boring how Beyoncé is taking all the flack for this "sex selling" shit.
At least she identifies as a feminist. I can't say as much for Katy Perry, Gaga, Miley, etc. But curiously no one accuses them of perverting 10-years old on every interview

rme

Edited at 2014-06-11 03:29 pm (UTC)
loonylolydarko 11th-Jun-2014 03:51 pm (UTC)
you're an idiot who cannot read
myselfdestruct 11th-Jun-2014 04:04 pm (UTC)
Reading is fundamental.
jothelion84 11th-Jun-2014 07:41 pm (UTC)
please read
waffle_party 12th-Jun-2014 04:57 am (UTC)
are u srs rn u sound ignorant
mots_inutiles 12th-Jun-2014 12:07 am (UTC)
Truth.

And I think Lily Tomlin is one of the lovliest women. And knowing the tone she was saying this in, and that it was all stream-of-consciousness and that she didn't give two shits about it - just makes me love her even more.
msbombtastic 11th-Jun-2014 03:20 pm (UTC)
I mean, I do agree that sexualised images are far too accessible for young children. but poor Beyonce has to take the heat for it lately idgi, she didn't originate the idea of selling a sexy image
zlatanwhy 11th-Jun-2014 03:25 pm (UTC)
how many artits are selling a sexy image and saying it's female empowerment tho

also she's a woc
phallus 11th-Jun-2014 03:27 pm (UTC)
Christina Aguilera did it back in 2003.
fionaapple 11th-Jun-2014 03:28 pm (UTC)
I would say Rihanna. Even Miley too.
hello_samm 11th-Jun-2014 04:04 pm (UTC)
maybe parents should have rules regarding what their children listen to and watch
nomoneyfun 11th-Jun-2014 04:13 pm (UTC)
IA that it's a systemic issue rather than an individual one but Beyonce isn't absolved of doing what everyone else does considering how much of an icon she is and how much career control she claims to have. There's nothing wrong with her being sexy but it's interesting that even when she's on the cover of Time magazine, being profiled as one of the most 100 influential women in the world, she's in a two-piece bikini. Like, damn. Is sex appeal the only way for women to get to the top and stay there?
disney_doctrine 11th-Jun-2014 04:49 pm (UTC)
i think because she's the one with the most recent sexual album out, it really just changes by which woman is out with a pop album dealing with sex-i feel like when miley dropped all we heard is about her corrupting the youth
vector_pole 11th-Jun-2014 03:21 pm (UTC)
lol this baity ass title.
myselfdestruct 11th-Jun-2014 04:05 pm (UTC)
LOL I was thinking the same thing. Trying to get people to come for the legend Lily.
bostongirl2003 11th-Jun-2014 04:14 pm (UTC)
I was afraid 2014 was gonna take another of my faves. :(
angi_is_altered 11th-Jun-2014 03:22 pm (UTC)
Loved her since I was little.
nuclearseasonz 11th-Jun-2014 03:22 pm (UTC)
I think it's great that women are reclaiming their sexuality but I don't think parading your sexuality is a part of that. I reclaim my sexuality by choosing my own partners and not letting a man dictate my actions. But I think it's unfortunate that women think reclaiming means acting sexually in public. You're actually still giving men what they want, only difference is maybe now you're the one profiting from it.
20727 11th-Jun-2014 03:29 pm (UTC)
"The idea of women empowering themselves by becoming sexual objects is backward. It seemed brilliant at one point, but it had really bad ramifications. Things lose their context so quickly." - kim gordon
zlatanwhy 11th-Jun-2014 03:42 pm (UTC)
this is my issue tbh if being empowered looks exactly the same as being objectified...
loonylolydarko 11th-Jun-2014 03:57 pm (UTC)
bingo

I love how people on ONTD and in general have this fantasy that women being open with their bodies = female empowerment, as if there were larger forces and systems at work that didn't offer an incentive for their self-exploitation. We let bastardizing of feminism convince the peons that a woman who busts it open is automatically a feminist because its her body rme

and in the same damn breath people will say that woc have very real problems of bodily ownership. like RMFE so we own our bodies and sexualize them healthily, for ourselves, except when we don't. And at that point the only way to decide who is and isn't is by arbitrarily choosing a fave.

this is why I got so over ONTD
bostongirl2003 11th-Jun-2014 04:14 pm (UTC)
I want this on a T-shirt
pistol_eyes 11th-Jun-2014 05:23 pm (UTC)
Tell it.

How the fuck is playing into the male gaze "empowering?"

If a pop chick wants to get naked, good for her. But people need to stop calling that "empowering" and "feminist."
fabby 11th-Jun-2014 05:47 pm (UTC)
<3
sassandthecity 11th-Jun-2014 03:40 pm (UTC)
My mom said she couldn't tell the difference between a woman owning her sexuality or having her sexuality exploited because they often times produce the same image nowadays.
burleyqgirl 11th-Jun-2014 03:56 pm (UTC)
I'm not going to structure my life and my appearance around not "giving men what they want" and deny myself the type of self-expression I enjoy because men might enjoy it also. That's a joyless way to live, and it still means defining yourself based on how men react to you. You don't have to walk around dressed like Courtney Stodden for men to check you out, objectify you and masturbate to you, and walking around in sweats with no makeup isn't going to stop them from objectifying you. Also, there will always be people claiming that you're "parading your sexuality" because that goalpost is constantly moving.
pacehim 11th-Jun-2014 04:07 pm (UTC)
Amen
msbombtastic 11th-Jun-2014 05:55 pm (UTC)
yeah, like if a woman is truly comfortable with and in control of how she presents her body that isn't any of my business. I guess the way I determine if I feel like it's empowering or not is by men's reactions - do they treat women who are empowered when they act sexually any different or better than women who don't feel empowered when they act sexually? They don't, and I don't personally find that to be empowering
mssykes 11th-Jun-2014 06:12 pm (UTC)
yep. it's great that women feel empowered to wear what they want/show their bodies, but why exactly are they doing so. what benefit do you get from posing half naked on a magazine... you're acting as another tool for some dick to get his rocks off to. there's nothing empowering about it. you want men to lust after you? ok. do your thing, but don't call it female empowerment because its not its still playing into "men will find me sexy omg yas" thing that most pop stars, including beyonce play heavily into.
theantipoet 11th-Jun-2014 03:23 pm (UTC)
I would seriously move to Detroit in a heartbeat if I could work from home and keep the same job/salary that I have in NYC.

buy a big old house and spend the money I saved not buying in NJ/NY on renovating it (though obv. the first renovation would probably be bars on the window and a high fence)
makesyoushake 11th-Jun-2014 03:27 pm (UTC)
I go to school in Detroit and i absolutely love it.. If i stay in Michigan after i'm done with school i think i would move there.
phallus 11th-Jun-2014 03:28 pm (UTC)
doubt the salary would stay the same.
goldengal1193 11th-Jun-2014 03:28 pm (UTC)
Detroit is just so........dead.

I want to move to a big city though. I think I'm going to when I graduate. I'm so sick of living in cow town(Ohio). Every time I visit another city there is just so much more to do.

I think I'm gonna relocate to Philadelphia or Pittsburgh since I'm sort of familiar with those cities from visiting a lot.
theantipoet 11th-Jun-2014 03:30 pm (UTC)
I like Philly a lot... I considered moving there after college, because 90% of my college friends seemed to end up there, but I could never find a job that matched what I was making in NYC.
stormydown 11th-Jun-2014 04:52 pm (UTC)
I live in Philly and I love it! I lived in NYC too but I prefer Philly. Cheaper and more intimate. I always felt so overwhelmed in NYC.
syvlie0o0 11th-Jun-2014 03:41 pm (UTC)
lmao no way would you have the same salary for the same sort of job.
goldengal1193 11th-Jun-2014 03:24 pm (UTC)
Lol, the title.
moetushie 11th-Jun-2014 03:25 pm (UTC)
I think it's asking way, way too much to ask for Beyonce to tone down her act because some hypothetical ten year olds might be looking up to her. First of all -- lots of Beyonce's fans aren't hypothetical ten year olds, they're adults and Bey's music fits well with them.

If your 10 yr old kid looks up to Beyonce, that's all fine and good, but for god's sake, Beyonce isn't the one parenti your child, you are. Exert some control over your kids, don't expect some pop star to do it for you.
solsty 11th-Jun-2014 03:27 pm (UTC)
Exactly. Not every little thing needs to be watered down for some hypothetical children.
endingonfire 11th-Jun-2014 03:41 pm (UTC)
This
loonylolydarko 11th-Jun-2014 03:59 pm (UTC)
yeah... I didn't mind what tomlin said, but I was struck by how quickly the children came up even though her point wasn't really that at all....
hello_samm 11th-Jun-2014 04:07 pm (UTC)
lol mte. my boyfriend's brother was watching 21 jump st and was complaining that he had to turn it off after 5 minutes: "i had my 6 year old son in the room and they were dry-humping and saying suck my d! what the hell!"

umm it's an r-rated movie for a reason you moron...
pacehim 11th-Jun-2014 04:10 pm (UTC)
I would still watch Beyonce if she wasn't so sexual b/c she is genuinely talented. Think Adele. How many other pop stars can say the say about?
shiningautumn 11th-Jun-2014 04:47 pm (UTC)
so true.
thewhowhatwhats 11th-Jun-2014 05:34 pm (UTC)
I think Beyonce's had a young fan base when she began, then an all-ages fan base for for the next part of her career, and seems to be focusing on an adult audience for this next era. I remembering her being aware of Destiny's Child's being overly sexual, when most of her fans were young girls. I always thought she was a good role model with the types of messages about being independent and having your own money.

I'm not really sure about how parents are supposed to reverse the effects of constant casual sexism in the media, except ban the from all media or making them go to purity balls.
cheekymonkeyboo 13th-Jun-2014 06:10 am (UTC)
think of the children seeing a nude woman's partially covered body...(something they came out of) think of how funny it is ~because the children!!!!!!~ nobody under the age of 13 should be basing any life choices off of musicians so....
fionaapple 11th-Jun-2014 03:25 pm (UTC)
why is it always Beyonce that is the target for the "sexualization" of media culture? she definitely wasn't the first pop star to think of dressing provocatively for attention. In our culture today I think we need to be more prone to blaming parents and other people in the child's life that is actually influential on them. Media culture is absolutely influential but I think we overestimate the extent to which a pop star influences someone's personal choices. It could be argued that media feeds society and society feeds media, it's just a gross never-ending circle and Beyonce is the scapegoat for people who can't accept their own responsibility in perpetuating this anti-sex culture.
phallus 11th-Jun-2014 03:30 pm (UTC)
Shes a woc, and the most popular pop star now.
chaka_kahn 11th-Jun-2014 03:41 pm (UTC)
i agree with you in part.

to the extent we focus on beyonce as a feminist in tandem with her self sexualization, among other issues - then i think it's right to focus on her since she's very vocal (conveniently so, imo) about being a feminist - whereas maybe katy perry/rihanna aren't forcefully putting out "Feminist" as part of their image that they want you to buy.
syvlie0o0 11th-Jun-2014 03:42 pm (UTC)
Cause she's just the most popular and in your face one right now? Miley has been on Xanax or something and isn't causing shit so people move on.
omni3 11th-Jun-2014 03:59 pm (UTC)
it's always been the 'it' person who gets all the heat.. always.. esp when it comes to women

back in the day it was marilyn monroe, then it was madonna, then it was queen britney (esp cause she had a lot of tween fans), now it's beyonce, and so on and so forth
loonylolydarko 11th-Jun-2014 04:03 pm (UTC)
well she's black so duh she'll be blamed for sexing up the kids

as for the discourses on feminism, she brought that on herself by publicly identifying and advocating for the cause while simultaneously engaging in things that are debatably problematic. she's black and rich and a contemporary talking point, and her stans are vile, of course she'll be brought up in most published pieces scantly mentioning feminism if a celeb is being interviewed. that is the nature of celebrity. you're acting like the treatment she's getting is unusual for celebrity.
fionaapple 11th-Jun-2014 04:08 pm (UTC)
It could be argued that media feeds society and society feeds media,

Read more at ONTD: http://ohnotheydidnt.livejournal.com/88884363.html?page=1#comments#ixzz34LbXpmAj
miss_almost 11th-Jun-2014 06:13 pm (UTC)
IA. if you call yourself a feminist but then do problematic things...you're opening yourself up to debate and being a discussion point.

i mean, high heels, dressing sexy, shaving, wearing a bra, shaking what god gave you, etc. can all be feminist talking points. so when you do all of those things and make loads of money off of it while saying youre a feminist...thats just a set up for a very rich discussion. is she, is she not? can she still be a feminist if shes doing un-feminist things constantly, if shes such a feminist then why is she perpetuating objectification for the male gaze/money, etc.
baby_mina 11th-Jun-2014 05:19 pm (UTC)
I love Beyonce. She's glittery and lace with fun music. I think the hate comes from the fact she generally has public approval while still being sexual.
bnmc2005 11th-Jun-2014 03:47 pm (UTC)
YUP...

Yet another tired, "(FEMALE celebrity) SAID '(nothing that bad, actually)'!!!! ABOUT (FEMALE celebrity)." OMG!!!!

(Don't read the comments in context) CUE EVERYONE TO WANK!
ponpiri 11th-Jun-2014 06:40 pm (UTC)
To be fair to the OP, this is the title most "news" outlets are using as well.
theupperdrive 11th-Jun-2014 03:26 pm (UTC)
that title tricked me. i thought this interview was going to be much different
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