5:52 pm - 02/10/2013
Some celebrities leave Reddit shortly after they collect easy publicity , but Star Trek's William Shatner isn't afraid to stick around and ruffle some feathers. An active user on the site since his first "Ask Me Anything" session in January, Shatner has issued some stern comments about the site's tolerance of hateful or racist users, writing that he is "appalled by some of the immature, horrifically racist, sexist, homophobic, ethnic, etc... posts that are just ignored here." Shatner questions Reddit's hands-off approach, writing that "the fact that someone could come here, debase and degrade people based on race, religion, ethnicity or sexual preference because 'they have a right' to do so without worry of any kind of moderation is sending the wrong message."
That attitude may seem to fly in the face of free speech — a value Reddit (mostly) supports — but Shatner's unimpressed when it comes to hate speech. In response to a comment goading him to become president of the United States ("because apparently you know best," the commenter wrote), Shatner replied: "first of all, I'm Canadian. Second of all Reddit is worldwide. So 'First Amendment' means nothing online."
While it's not the first time Reddit's model has been criticized, Shatner's comments highlight the site's ongoing struggle to gain mainstream credibility while embracing offensive or undesirable content. Shatner wrote that "Reddit has been the first 'mainstream' site that I have been to that actually appears to allow racists and other hate mongers to group, congregate, incite and spread their hatred." While some users noted Reddit's voting system, which allows users to promote or suppress content to their liking, Shatner was unconvinced about its efficacy: "you obviously agree with me that there are 'shameful comments' on Reddit that users can downvote and hide," he writes in a response to another user, "but they are still here at the end of the day as are the accounts that make them. Do you believe that the folks who don these cyber masks to post hatred will stop making them because they get downvoted?"
Reddit only has a few official rules, including no spam, no personal information, no cheating the system, and no suggestive or sexual content featuring minors. The site has a much broader set of values, called Reddiquette, that consists of suggestions about how to behave -- but it's completely up to individual community moderators to create and enforce rules. Shatner, perhaps like many others who stumble on the site, doesn't seem to appreciate the difference between Reddiquette and the community's official rules. "All I am asking is why there are rules if they are not enforced," Shatner writes. "If censoring or disabling accounts is not an outcome of breaking the rules, then what exactly is?" (Of course, users do get banned from the site and from individual subreddits, but those decisions are often left to volunteer community moderators with nearly-unlimited power.) "I do not pretend to know where the managers of Reddit wish to go with this site," Shatner writes, "but embracing that kind of culture I feel is counterproductive to where this world is heading."
As a member of polite society, Shatner may not fully understand the people he's dealing with -- but that doesn't mean he can't change hearts and minds. The "ShitRedditSays" (SRS) community — one of the site's most controversial subreddits, often providing a running satirical commentary on Reddit's culture — honored Shatner by placing his face on its banner. In response, Shatner asked a Reddit user to act as a digital courier: "could I ask that you send a message over to whomever runs SRS? I would like the banner removed. I do not feel it's appropriate and I am not a member there." The banner was removed shortly after Shatner's request.
Source, Original Thread
William Shatner vs. Reddit
Some celebrities leave Reddit shortly after they collect easy publicity , but Star Trek's William Shatner isn't afraid to stick around and ruffle some feathers. An active user on the site since his first "Ask Me Anything" session in January, Shatner has issued some stern comments about the site's tolerance of hateful or racist users, writing that he is "appalled by some of the immature, horrifically racist, sexist, homophobic, ethnic, etc... posts that are just ignored here." Shatner questions Reddit's hands-off approach, writing that "the fact that someone could come here, debase and degrade people based on race, religion, ethnicity or sexual preference because 'they have a right' to do so without worry of any kind of moderation is sending the wrong message."
That attitude may seem to fly in the face of free speech — a value Reddit (mostly) supports — but Shatner's unimpressed when it comes to hate speech. In response to a comment goading him to become president of the United States ("because apparently you know best," the commenter wrote), Shatner replied: "first of all, I'm Canadian. Second of all Reddit is worldwide. So 'First Amendment' means nothing online."
While it's not the first time Reddit's model has been criticized, Shatner's comments highlight the site's ongoing struggle to gain mainstream credibility while embracing offensive or undesirable content. Shatner wrote that "Reddit has been the first 'mainstream' site that I have been to that actually appears to allow racists and other hate mongers to group, congregate, incite and spread their hatred." While some users noted Reddit's voting system, which allows users to promote or suppress content to their liking, Shatner was unconvinced about its efficacy: "you obviously agree with me that there are 'shameful comments' on Reddit that users can downvote and hide," he writes in a response to another user, "but they are still here at the end of the day as are the accounts that make them. Do you believe that the folks who don these cyber masks to post hatred will stop making them because they get downvoted?"
Reddit only has a few official rules, including no spam, no personal information, no cheating the system, and no suggestive or sexual content featuring minors. The site has a much broader set of values, called Reddiquette, that consists of suggestions about how to behave -- but it's completely up to individual community moderators to create and enforce rules. Shatner, perhaps like many others who stumble on the site, doesn't seem to appreciate the difference between Reddiquette and the community's official rules. "All I am asking is why there are rules if they are not enforced," Shatner writes. "If censoring or disabling accounts is not an outcome of breaking the rules, then what exactly is?" (Of course, users do get banned from the site and from individual subreddits, but those decisions are often left to volunteer community moderators with nearly-unlimited power.) "I do not pretend to know where the managers of Reddit wish to go with this site," Shatner writes, "but embracing that kind of culture I feel is counterproductive to where this world is heading."
As a member of polite society, Shatner may not fully understand the people he's dealing with -- but that doesn't mean he can't change hearts and minds. The "ShitRedditSays" (SRS) community — one of the site's most controversial subreddits, often providing a running satirical commentary on Reddit's culture — honored Shatner by placing his face on its banner. In response, Shatner asked a Reddit user to act as a digital courier: "could I ask that you send a message over to whomever runs SRS? I would like the banner removed. I do not feel it's appropriate and I am not a member there." The banner was removed shortly after Shatner's request.
Source, Original Thread
"Do not introduce new arguments while another argument has yet to be resolved."
You must have not followed your little chart, though, because this has nothing to do with the point I was trying to make.
I'm not here defending the shit that gets posted on Reddit. The original argument at hand from the OP of the thread was that since you visit the site, you're guilty for everything that goes on. That's the SAME EXACT THING as calling an LJ user guilty for whatever happens in this and/or other communities. You have control of what subreddit's you want to join, just like how you have control of what communities you want to join on LJ. And each subreddit/community will have the bad seeds.
And everything else? I already said you beat the same argument to its tired death.
And nope, reread their comment again, because you're doing exactly what they said. How many times do I have to say that reddit connotes a culture that's far more exacerbated in its neckbeardness than even LJ???? Your comparison is already flawed. They're two different systems, again. Control doesn't mean shit to your argument when communities aren't even the founding part of LJ, especially since you can avoid them for your entire stay. Reddit FORCES you to interact because it's at its foremost a discussion-oriented content aggregation website. i'd love to see you try to go without interacting with another human on reddit. Two. Different. Things. Stop being cray.